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Being a high school dropout.

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  • #16
    Re: Being a high school dropout.

    Originally posted by Cutliquidsnake View Post
    Hey, thanks! I'm glad I'm not the only one who hates food service, haha.
    I'm impressed that you've lasted 2+ years at each of those jobs (I didn't). That's why management likes you; you're reliable enough.

    Now talk to your counselor about ADD and maybe they can get help for you on that...

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    • #17
      Re: Being a high school dropout.

      I'm a tad late to the game, but I'll still put in my thoughts. First, I'm glad to see that you are going to go back and finish up that last class for a diploma! While college isn't an essential for everyone, having at least the diploma makes it easier to verify what you actually want to do for the rest of your life by getting other vocational jobs. From there, if you find the one you want to do, you can go to a trade/vocational school for that.

      As for the fast food aspect, I'm not going to lie- I did think it was an easy job. That is, until I actually worked food service in college. I would call my first one easy, but with completely incompetant management. (Student management can be a problem...) But when I went to another place that knew what it was doing, working back there on the grill was hectic! Cooking the burgers, chicken, frying up the fries and rings, crisping the bacon, and... what do you mean the fixings bar is out of tomato? And this was one small part of the restaurant! And then I acknowledged: it was tough! Don't sell yourself short on that aspect!

      Finally, the loser part. One Vorlon has it right- dropping out alone doesn't make you a loser, being about 30 in an entry-level job does. But not everyone sees it this way. There are some people who will look at things and be like "Cheh, he couldn't even be bothered to finish school, what a loser." This attitude does exist in the corporate world, sadly, which brings us back to the first part- of getting that degree! Good luck with that! ^_^
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      • #18
        Re: Being a high school dropout.

        Originally posted by Cutliquidsnake View Post
        . . . I am definitely going to Summer School this year to finish my class. . .
        Good for you! When you get your diploma, let us know - we'll set up a celebratory thread to toast your success.
        "The roaring of lions, the howling of wolves, the raging of the stormy sea, and the destructive sword, are portions of eternity too great for the eye of man."

        -William Blake, "The Marriage of Heaven and Hell"

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        • #19
          Re: Being a high school dropout.

          It doesn't make you a loser. But without a high school degree you are committing yourself to a life of minium wage jobs, and really no opportunities at all. I don't want to tell you what to do with your life, but seriously If you're ONE CLASS away from graduating then just bite the bullet and do it. I mean do you want the rest of your life to be terrible because when you were 21 years old you couldn't go to class? Most high schools don't want to see you drop out, they'll help you if you ask for it I'm sure. I know you seem to be going through a lot of real life problems, try and get through them. I know others have suggested getting a GED, which is an option I suppose. But I disagree, just try and finish that one class. I say if you only have one class left then just do it. You're so very close.

          As for what to do as a job, there's plenty of manual labor jobs that pay decently - good, that require absolutely no fast paced thinking like working in a restaurant does . You could do landscaping for the government, cemeteries, or parks etc. These jobs pay pretty well after you have the years in. You could load boxes (Fedex or UPS) , work in construction, factories, etc etc. the list goes on and on. But to have a good chance of getting these jobs, you should have a high school degree.
          Last edited by Prede; 02-12-2012, 08:47 PM.
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          • #20
            Re: Being a high school dropout.

            Originally posted by Prede View Post
            As for what to do as a job, there's plenty of manual labor jobs that pay decently - good, that require absolutely no fast paced thinking like working in a restaurant does . You could do landscaping for the government, cemeteries, or parks etc. These jobs pay pretty well after you have the years in. You could load boxes (Fedex or UPS) , work in construction, factories, etc etc. the list goes on and on. But to have a good chance of getting these jobs, you should have a high school degree.
            Actually most of the jobs you listed require a degree and at least some college. Landscaping, Undertaker, and Park Ranger certainly do.

            Also while you can do loading dock work at UPS, there are jobs that require much less effort and pay better without a degree. Also loading doc is shift and seasonal work. Generally about ~5 hours a day at UPS from 3am until 8 or 9 even during the holiday season. The trucks come in from the airport, you unload them then go home. You get paid hourly so unless you are working sorting, you really aren't going to make that a full time job.

            Yes I know some people who do dock work as a full time job, just not for UPS or FedEx. Those companies go by the principal of "keep as few people on hand as necessary." They aren't going to pay a bunch of people to stand around and do nothing between shipments so you're going to be sent home early more days than not. Only keep them in mind if you want extra work for the holiday season.
            Figure Enthusiast
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            • #21
              Re: Being a high school dropout.

              This article references what I was talking about when I say "go to a trade school". The jobs are out there, but people aren't training to take them.

              Knowing what you want to do for a living is the most important thing to finding a job.
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              • #22
                Re: Being a high school dropout.

                Originally posted by Gatts View Post
                This article references what I was talking about when I say "go to a trade school". The jobs are out there, but people aren't training to take them.
                While trade school is a good option for some people, it also limits your options more than a BS. Also, the odds are better if you have a degree (if you're over 25). I realize "not trying to beat the median" is not a popular strategy, but I do think it is the wise one. Just like you're not going to win the lottery, you're not going to be the guy who drops out of college and becomes a multi-billionare (although, by all means, if someone does manage to get into Harvard and has a great idea, drop out. You already have the main benefit of going: the connections). Outliers are rare precisely because they're outliers.

                Basically, I don't dispute there is a $30 an hour job that requires technical skills at Marlin Steel Wire Products. But how many other jobs there pay $8-$16? Most of the people I know who work in a factory are making in that range and also seem to have very little job security. The only two job openings on their website are for a PROCESS ENGINEER and Maintenance Mechanic so it's hard to determine what the median wage is there.

                That said, someone can always go back for a BS later upon completion of an AA (like AA nursing then BSN to expand your career options).

                I will say this: in my experience, most of those going to night school at the local community college are first generation immigrants--all of whom are studying pre-med, pre-pharmacology, engineering, or nursing.
                Last edited by Draneor; 03-03-2012, 04:42 PM.
                Clannad is Life, Da Capo is Pure Love, Higurashi is Ethics, & Tori no Uta is the National Anthem.

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                • #23
                  Re: Being a high school dropout.

                  Originally posted by Draneor View Post
                  you're not going to be the guy who drops out of college and becomes a multi-billionare
                  Steve Jobs
                  Bill Gates
                  Mark Zuckerberg
                  Lawrence Ellison
                  Michael Dell
                  Ted Turner

                  It seems to me if you want to be a billionaire, you need to have a unique idea and the desire to chase it. Effort is more important than school learning. If you don't have any desire and don't try to do anything you aren't going to be a billionaire. It's not about being a dropout or not being a dropout. Money doesn't fall in your lap. Of course if money isn't your goal and just making it through life is your goal, it's much better to do something you want to do instead of being stuck with a BS working a desk job and being miserable because you don't like what you are doing or who you are with.

                  Oh and to continue on with the previous list

                  Kevin Durant
                  LeBron James
                  Kobe Bryant

                  I believe Roger Federer didn't go to college either. Talent in your chosen field is also a good substitute to a proper education.
                  Last edited by Gatts; 03-03-2012, 06:30 PM.
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                  • #24
                    Re: Being a high school dropout.

                    Apparently, you don't understand the concept of "outlier." "LeBron James," for example, is an extreme outlier. The vast majority of basketball players are not going to go pro. Even most pro-ballers don't make near as much as he does. The vast majority of college dropouts are not Bill Gates. Hell, even Bill Gates fucking understands this (which is why his foundation pushes so hard for education). Basing your life plan on the idea that you're going to be the exception to the rule is foolish.
                    Clannad is Life, Da Capo is Pure Love, Higurashi is Ethics, & Tori no Uta is the National Anthem.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Being a high school dropout.

                      Originally posted by Gatts View Post
                      Originally posted by Draneor View Post
                      you're not going to be the guy who drops out of college and becomes a multi-billionare
                      Steve Jobs
                      Bill Gates
                      Mark Zuckerberg
                      Lawrence Ellison
                      Michael Dell
                      Ted Turner
                      And if I were to try and make a list of billionaires who saw their post secondary education through to the end, how long would that be? Or could I just summarize by saying "All the others"?
                      "Pledge $1000 or more: I will yell your name really loud while I chase a duck."
                      -My Collection
                      --[plug] I review and blog about anime at Akemi's Anime World [/plug]

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                      • #26
                        Re: Being a high school dropout.

                        Originally posted by Draneor View Post
                        Basing your life plan on the idea that you're going to be the exception to the rule is foolish.
                        Believing that you need to go to college in order to further your life goals is also foolish. Effort is what is needed in life and effort comes much easier when you are doing something you want to do. I'm not saying that you don't have to go to college (ignoring that this is a High School drop out thread not a "should I go to college thread), I'm saying that before you decide if you need to go, you need to know what you want to do.

                        You seem to think that I'm saying "don't go to college" when what I'm really saying is if you have no goal in life then it doesn't matter if you get a college education. The most important thing that a college education will give you is knowledge of how to work within an established environment. The advantage that a college education will give you is that other people will know that you at least have the ability to work in an established environment and likely that you can deal with high stress situations and red tape. College can help you make your decision by giving you a lot of choices and a general foundation, but without any desire to do anything, then you are just wasting time and money.
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                        • #27
                          Re: Being a high school dropout.

                          Originally posted by Legion View Post
                          And if I were to try and make a list of billionaires who saw their post secondary education through to the end, how long would that be? Or could I just summarize by saying "All the others"?
                          Believe it or not, vocational and trade schools are considered post secondary education.

                          *edit*
                          Also technically everyone on my list besides LeBron, Kobe, and Durant had at least some post secondary. Even Carmello Anthony went to college for one year, thus had one year of post secondary.
                          Last edited by Gatts; 03-04-2012, 10:22 AM.
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                          • #28
                            Re: Being a high school dropout.

                            Originally posted by Gatts View Post
                            Originally posted by Legion View Post
                            And if I were to try and make a list of billionaires who saw their post secondary education through to the end, how long would that be? Or could I just summarize by saying "All the others"?
                            Believe it or not, vocational and trade schools are considered post secondary education.
                            I do believe it, and never said otherwise. I'm not sure how this response is relevent to my reply.

                            Originally posted by Gatts View Post
                            Also technically everyone on my list besides LeBron, Kobe, and Durant had at least some post secondary. Even Carmello Anthony went to college for one year, thus had one year of post secondary.
                            Right, I was commenting on a list you made of billionaires who found their fortune after dropping out of college. I was openly wondering how many billionaires found their fortune after completing their post secondary education. I am asserting more billionaires made their fortune after completing college than not.

                            Hell, there are probably a few billionaires out there who made their fortune without even completing high school, but no one is going to recommend Cutliquidsnake forgo the completion of his high school education, even if he knew exactly what he wanted to do with his life.

                            Originally posted by Gatts View Post
                            You seem to think that I'm saying "don't go to college" when what I'm really saying is if you have no goal in life then it doesn't matter if you get a college education. The most important thing that a college education will give you is knowledge of how to work within an established environment. The advantage that a college education will give you is that other people will know that you at least have the ability to work in an established environment and likely that you can deal with high stress situations and red tape. College can help you make your decision by giving you a lot of choices and a general foundation, but without any desire to do anything, then you are just wasting time and money.
                            That... doesn't seem right. I thought the point of college was to help you figure out what you want to do with your life? College isn't for everybody but just because you don't know exactly what you want to do is no reason to dismiss the option. I'm getting close to 30 and I've applied to go back to school for this September. I know the degree I want, but do I know exactly what I want to do with it after I get it? No, but I'm damn skippy I'll figure it out by that time. My school will have resources and people for me to use to help hammer out a goal.

                            Education: it's a good thing.
                            "Pledge $1000 or more: I will yell your name really loud while I chase a duck."
                            -My Collection
                            --[plug] I review and blog about anime at Akemi's Anime World [/plug]

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                            • #29
                              Re: Being a high school dropout.

                              Originally posted by Gatts View Post
                              Believing that you need to go to college in order to further your life goals is also foolish.
                              Did I make this argument? I believe the argument I made was that the median college graduate has more options than the median college drop out. This is, in fact, true. The median college graduate also has a higher household income and a lower unemployment rate. Pointing at outliers does not invalidate the data.

                              The fact of the matter is the vast majority of us aren't exceptional. We're not going to be Lebron James. It's utterly bad advice to say to a kid playing ball in college "if you work hard enough, you'll make it in the NBA so don't worry about what you'll do if you don't." Or to a highschool drop out "I know this one guy who never graduated high school, but he made his own small business and is now a millionaire so that could be you." Outliers make great inspirational stories, but you need to look at the characteristics of the population to have an accurate picture of what being a highschool drop out is really like.

                              So given that the fast majority of us--including myself--would be lucky to even be at the median (since 50% of the population would below you), I advise doing anything you can to tip the odds in your favor. If that means studying engineering, becoming a CPA, or getting a certificate in welding, then so be it.

                              Originally posted by Gatts View Post
                              Effort is what is needed in life and effort comes much easier when you are doing something you want to do.[...] You seem to think that I'm saying "don't go to college" when what I'm really saying is if you have no goal in life then it doesn't matter if you get a college education.
                              Effort is only part of it. There's also a whole lot of chance and consequences of past choices. Sometimes, the process of human reproduction fucks up and you're born with down syndrome (or not at all, as a fatal genetic combination results in a miscarriage). Sometimes, your born in a first world country and thus already rich on a global scale by virtue of your birth location. I'd agree you can only control effort and your present choices, but it's not as simple as that. Effort can't always make up for the fact that, back when you were 16, you didn't use protection and knocked up your girlfriend, thus resulting in having to drop out of HS to support a child. Both effort and chance/choices are important.
                              Clannad is Life, Da Capo is Pure Love, Higurashi is Ethics, & Tori no Uta is the National Anthem.

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                              • #30
                                Re: Being a high school dropout.

                                Originally posted by Legion View Post
                                Right, I was commenting on a list you made of billionaires who found their fortune after dropping out of college. I was openly wondering how many billionaires found their fortune after completing their post secondary education. I am asserting more billionaires made their fortune after completing college than not.
                                Originally posted by Draneor View Post
                                The fact of the matter is the vast majority of us aren't exceptional. We're not going to be Lebron James. It's utterly bad advice to say to a kid playing ball in college "if you work hard enough, you'll make it in the NBA so don't worry about what you'll do if you don't." Or to a highschool drop out "I know this one guy who never graduated high school, but he made his own small business and is now a millionaire so that could be you." Outliers make great inspirational stories, but you need to look at the characteristics of the population to have an accurate picture of what being a highschool drop out is really like.
                                Easier to answer two at once.

                                You both say that the person I know personally who is a self made person is rare and that the people with exceptional talent, the Kobe's and LeBron's of the world are rare. People who become millionaires off of a college education are just as rare as the people who do it through talent. The vast majority of people who graduate from college go on to have 50~60k jobs. That's not millionaire money.

                                Teachers make around 30k per year and the require a master's degree.
                                An accountant makes about 80k and requires a Bachelors and a CPA (which is about the equivalent of a masters)
                                A System Administrator at a tech corporation requires a highschool diploma and various certifications. They make around 80k per year (again this is industrial average)
                                A programmer makes around 120k and they require a Bachelors or relevant experience.
                                Animal Husbandry makes about 200k and requires either a master or a TON of job experience.

                                and you know what? None of these jobs, which are all good college graduate jobs, will make you a multi-millionaire.

                                The majority of multi-millionaires in America are out of the entertainment fields. You have Paris Hilton rich because her daddy is rich. Snookie, rich because she's obnoxious. William Hung still makes a living off of one appearance on American Idol. Chris Cagle songwriter. Chris Bridges (aka Ludacris) company CEO and songwriter. Of course you can be a college graduate and work in the entertainment industry like Vince McMahon or Roger Goodell. There's nothing wrong with that.

                                Then you have the people who are day traders who are millionaires (of course that's not a stable way to make a living since one economic turn means you are bankrupt).

                                Then you have the people with vocational talent. These can be college grads or just people who work into their fields. HVAC repairman. Fiber Optics installation. AV installation. Landscaper. Construction. Nursing. Chef. Day Care/Child Care. Hell, you can become career military if you want (of course officer's school technically is college, but you can just be career enlisted if you wanted). These are all careers that you can work with or without college degrees and make just as much money as a traditional college graduate.

                                Heck you can even make a decent living playing video games now. MLG, IGN Pro League, etc, but the amount of time dedicated to mastering a single game might be a bit much for most people. (if your parents want to support your bum lifestyle while you build up the necessary skills to become a pro gamer, that could always work. )

                                The biggest challenge is making up your mind and taking the initiative.
                                Last edited by Gatts; 03-04-2012, 04:04 PM.
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